I had a series of bad luck today and my own stupidity, so this may sound a bit harsh, but I think it should be said. Those mistakes were mistakes that aren't a trouble on other chars, but are much more grave and annoying on channelers. So, I would like to vent something that has been on my mind lately a lot and would like to hear the opinions of others. Perhaps I am wrong. Or perhaps I am right and the time of normal channelers within this world has ended.
Really, what is the point now? I am considering leaving my non Aes Sedai channeler alts to rot. I am sometimes really wondering, what is the future of this class in the game. Is the point of the changes to make them too annoying to be played?
After the changes (lower hp, some weapon stats and eq), it is extremely annoying to exp on a channeler and to explore and interact with the world individually. This has always been one of my favourite parts of the game. Roaming around, exploring, questing, relaxing this way independently. Now, it is horrible. Getting lost with any aggro mobs around is very likely to be deadly. The eq choices are lower and harder to reequip. Yes, perhaps the leatherleaf stuff was a too common choice and that's why it was made heavier. But daggers, fencing blades, or flails are much harder to reequip. I have a limited amount of free time, so every death is really annoying because of eq on unclanned channeler alts (and I don't have that much even on the clanned ones to eq everything from my personal rents. I play in the less populated time zones, so a huge smob group harvesting half the map is a rare thing for me). Everything is much more difficult and slower nowadays on a channeler. And eve good dodge is definitely not sufficient for a channeler wandering around the continent alone.
Probably, being a channeler is supposed to suck in pk now. Well, the learning curve is really bad now, even worse than before (and it would be great to have easier reequiping of the stuff channelers tend to wear and wield, considering the fact we are supposed to die so easily). But I wouldn't mind that as much as being horrible against non-players. Is it just my impression or is a level thirtysomething channeler with standard combo equal to a lithe woman mob? It is annoying. The exp trainer taking scalps is awesome (one of my favourite recent changes to the game) but the channelers have an extremely hard time killing the mobs supposed to be for their level. Is the goal really making everything too painful for a channeler without a babysitter?
But it is not the only thing, the channelers are not what they are supposed to be right now. What the clans look like and do somehow doesn't fit not only the books but I'd say that not even in the wotmud history and atmosphere.
The Tower: a lot of things work much better than they used to now and there have been lots of positive changes. But still, these positive changes came after several years of hell (sometime around 2014-17? but now I am guessing the exact years) and there are extremely few active lower ranks here now as a consequence. The novices and Accepteds are supposed to be the main channeler clan, with a reasonable part of the people progressing at a reasonable pace towards the Shawl. The Shawling works now. But there are few lowranks. It is really weird that these days, we usually get several Aes Sedai on and one Accepted. I am afraid the future of the White Tower is not bright. We are still paying for past mistakes most of us had no control over. Also, it simply wrong that the Aes Sedai are supposed to simply play along with damane or other channelers in the north now. Either that (and not grouping directly is a tiny detail there), or leaving.
The Kin: While we cannot go as far as in the books and drag those discovered to the Tower of course, is it really ok that they are running around weaving publicly clanned weaves without any consequences, and pking all the time? It is not just Gretchen, who doesn't pay much attention to keeping a low profile, which is supposed to be part of that, no? They are not really a secret clan as far as the behaviour of many goes, but we are supposed to pretend blindness. Yet, they are a secret clan as far as clanning requirements and process goes. The combination of these two seems weird. I had a fun rp interactiong with Gretchen who is in Tar Valon all the time, and who said she was not dragging novices away but rather the novices swarming to apply to kin instead. Was that true? And isn't there something weird about all of that?
The Damane: As a player, I am glad that players of former Accepteds, usually burnt out and sometimes for good reasons, have something else to do with the characters they've invested a lot in. But are damane really supposed to be in the borderlands instead of the White Tower? Something is really wrong, if even this alternative is so much more attractive and has no big disadvantages compared to the White Tower. No, waiting till rank 5 for the clanned weaves is no huge disadvantage with rather fast ranking there and with no zone restrictions after rank 1, and with no real risks from the LS in the most important zones of the game.
The Wisdoms seem fine from the outside, I cannot guess about the inside. We no longer have the incidents of some wisdoms blinding people in the cities for fun. They pk but otherwise stick to covering their healing weaves with the proper bandages. They are great in many ways and focus not primarily on channeling, which seems to be their point.
The other clans taking channelers without the clanned weaves: Legion (traditional and without problems), Dragonsworn (dying out), Kandori Merchants (yet to be seen in the long run). Have I forgotten anything?
Bookishly, there should be the Aes Sedai as the most visible and officially powerful channelers, we could say it is still true.
The primary visible identidy of a non Aes Sedai channeler should be a white dress or the one with banded hem. Well, this is no longer true, as all the other options are competing with this traditional path and the bad reputation of the Tower is hard to fight.
The sul'dam and damane have bookishly nothing to do on majority of the continent, and shouldn't be tolerated by others. They are channelers who haven't sworn the Oaths, they are weapons of the enemy and wish to enslave everyone. Yet, the White Tower is not allowed to go into wars, and nobody will fight them in the north, where they seem to be spending majority of time these days.
The rest of the channelers is supposed to be unseen, unnoticed.
Am I the only one seeing this situation as weird and wrong? Is it gonna change to the better? Is anything players could do for improvement?
Basically, I think the Tower should be able to enter the wars under some conditions. They are a way to gain or lose power, the Tower is allowed to only pretend to have any importance, to talk about alliances with others, and do nothing. The Damane can go to war with the rest of the Seanchan, can't they?
To remove a huge symbol of the Tower problems, we should finally get rid of the stupid zone restrictions for all the Accepteds and completely, not with the frog boiling method. I don't mind saying it publicly, I find them extremely stupid. The ones for novices are ok, the novices can progress fast these days. The Journey Accepteds not going to Spine have never made any sense. The Journey Accepteds not going to the north, while damane are there, that doesn't make sense now. And the Tower Accepteds not going to the south east, that also doesn't make sense, if damane can go everywhere from rank 2 on. We talk about this regularly in the Tower. What do the outsiders think? Would you try your dormant Tower alts again, if this nonsense was removed?
The ranking process within the Tower works quite well know, people give us a chance please, we will give it to you too. It is not necessary to avoid the Tower in order to enjoy playing a channeler. I remember damn well how frustrating it sometimes is. And trust me, lots of things have changed.
There should be consequences for the Kin and anyone else supposed to be hidden and not giving a damn about it. No matter how much I might like Gretchen as a player (and sorry about using you as the example but you are simply the most visible) and value and enjoy smobbing with her or anything she participates on, a clanned weave in front of a Tower member or reported to us should have some consequences. People declanning the Tower get the weird runaway flag for a year (originally forever) and get farmed just for showing up in TV, nothing more. Other people weave fireballs and other weaves they should have no clue about, do publicly everything an Aes Sedai does, and nothing happens. Is that alright? Shouldn't there be some catching of these wilders and runaways and farming them going on, or docking by their clans for drawing attention, or something?
I am trying an mc too. I had expected it to be really hard due to all the secrecy and the risk of turning everyone against you, because of the worse stats and pracs for the other skills and so on. I had expected to need time to learn how to live with not channeling bellow strong, with slowly tainting, with trying to do totally different stuff than normally and trying to be the mad bad guy. I hadn't expected there to be a problem due to damn exping with 280 hps. Truth be told, I may be tainted before my first pk. The character sucks with the weaves and is horrible without. FC with 280 hps make some sense, despite being too annoying. MCs with 280 hps make no sense at all, perhaps just to not win over Aes Sedai too easily.
What do you think?
Quo vadis, the channeler class?
Re: Quo vadis, the channeler class?
With no offense intended, perhaps you are not ready to play the channeler class. The 280 hp max is just a blip vs. the massive list of reasons why channelers are extremely powerful (probably still too powerful) on this game. This is from someone who plays almost entirely channeler alts (dl, accepted, mcs, etc).
I'm actually relatively ok with how channelers are today with the exception of bonded AS (draining hps is just frankly broken as firetruck), multiple channelers weaving the same target with no max engage or reduction on damage, stupid HOA, and time stabs blicking you from full. In the grand scheme of things, except for the multiple channelers weaving a single target, none of this is really that big a deal.
Stop trying to kill things by yourself. Make friends with big strong warriors who can buff and bash things for you, and watch your weaves do more damage in shorter amounts of time than they ever could.
I'm actually relatively ok with how channelers are today with the exception of bonded AS (draining hps is just frankly broken as firetruck), multiple channelers weaving the same target with no max engage or reduction on damage, stupid HOA, and time stabs blicking you from full. In the grand scheme of things, except for the multiple channelers weaving a single target, none of this is really that big a deal.
Stop trying to kill things by yourself. Make friends with big strong warriors who can buff and bash things for you, and watch your weaves do more damage in shorter amounts of time than they ever could.
Re: Quo vadis, the channeler class?
Hi Callesa. I will give you equipment if you need some. Also you should pk with me lots, if you wish to learn pk, as I will make sure you are regeared if you get the dead, and I will help you do the exp. Obviously, I suggest you do this on DS first so you get a feel of how I pk. I will not force you to do anything however, so if you wanna do it on Callesa then you can! I am not very good at the exploring and the smobsings and such that you like, so I am no help there.
Concerning Kin:
They are pretty gimped, they have nothing to do really. I don't blame them for the most part for going and pking when we don't really have anything else to do, considering the who list is either Tower/SS/CoL most of the time.
Concerning Tower and other channelers:
Out of the game you have a few different clans or paths that allow you to achieve clanned weaves, which are the most powerful items in the game.
The White Tower is probably the most strict and rewarding path to clanned weaves.
1. White Tower
2. Damane/Sul'dam
3. Kin
4. Known Darkfriend
5. Male Channeler.
6. Wisdom
7. Remort to a Dreadlord via DS
Each of these clans or paths chosen comes with a unique set of prerequisites and their own repercussions for clan weaves. I think this is well balanced for the most part.
280 hps and Channelers:
Personally I don't think Channelers need more hps. You have weaves that do upwards of 150 hp of dmg in within 10 pulses. The addition of master damage to master weaves is also very powerful. There used to be channelers running around with 350+ hp, doing these 150 dmg weaves. That makes them more than a glass cannon, and more of just a cannon in general. Even with 280 hp, there are fcs easily able to solo multiple opponents by themselves.
Male Channeler Bonuses:
Male Channelers are unique. They taint, unless taking certain paths. They receive a bonus to practices, as warrior pracs for them are only 3, where as a female channeler, warrior pracs are 4.
Damane and the borderlands:
I am biased here as I personally hate seanchan. They're annoying and they just talk dung on globals all day, like they used to do in yells when they were their own race and expect you to hit them at channeling mobs like you're some kind of idiot. I don't think Damane should be allowed in the borderlands considering relations with the White Tower. Not for me to decide however!
When it comes down to it, the only person limiting you to have fun is yourself. There are a lot of channelers who think outside the box, an example would be Erulisse. She just stabs smobs and explores the world without much problem.
Concerning Kin:
They are pretty gimped, they have nothing to do really. I don't blame them for the most part for going and pking when we don't really have anything else to do, considering the who list is either Tower/SS/CoL most of the time.
Concerning Tower and other channelers:
Out of the game you have a few different clans or paths that allow you to achieve clanned weaves, which are the most powerful items in the game.
The White Tower is probably the most strict and rewarding path to clanned weaves.
1. White Tower
2. Damane/Sul'dam
3. Kin
4. Known Darkfriend
5. Male Channeler.
6. Wisdom
7. Remort to a Dreadlord via DS
Each of these clans or paths chosen comes with a unique set of prerequisites and their own repercussions for clan weaves. I think this is well balanced for the most part.
280 hps and Channelers:
Personally I don't think Channelers need more hps. You have weaves that do upwards of 150 hp of dmg in within 10 pulses. The addition of master damage to master weaves is also very powerful. There used to be channelers running around with 350+ hp, doing these 150 dmg weaves. That makes them more than a glass cannon, and more of just a cannon in general. Even with 280 hp, there are fcs easily able to solo multiple opponents by themselves.
Male Channeler Bonuses:
Male Channelers are unique. They taint, unless taking certain paths. They receive a bonus to practices, as warrior pracs for them are only 3, where as a female channeler, warrior pracs are 4.
Damane and the borderlands:
I am biased here as I personally hate seanchan. They're annoying and they just talk dung on globals all day, like they used to do in yells when they were their own race and expect you to hit them at channeling mobs like you're some kind of idiot. I don't think Damane should be allowed in the borderlands considering relations with the White Tower. Not for me to decide however!
When it comes down to it, the only person limiting you to have fun is yourself. There are a lot of channelers who think outside the box, an example would be Erulisse. She just stabs smobs and explores the world without much problem.
Re: Quo vadis, the channeler class?
I don't think channelers suck in pk now. It's more important to be in dodge than a few years ago, but that's a different matter. The main skills for succeeding as a channeler are the same as for other classes: zone knowledge, situational awareness, and preparation. A lot of channies don't follow basic preparation for northern pk, and show up with bad horses, no vials, mediocre gear, and limited combat weaves. Changing port made an important difference, and had good results in my opinion.Callesa wrote:Probably, being a channeler is supposed to suck in pk now.
An under-appreciated point about the removal of moblead is it made non-channelers more valuable in northern PK. Channies didn't have to worry about moblead because they could work around it through targeted weaving, and would usually prefer to be buffing a mob rather than a master basher. Non-channies now don't have to worry about PK sessions that are primarily killing trolloc mobs for 20 minutes and then going back to Fal Dara. That's good for everyone, although I think the composition has swung to having a lot of human rogues in northern PK, which I don't love.
Re: Quo vadis, the channeler class?
I think you're doing something wrong. I can solo things on Kathala that I can't solo on most of my other alts. Sure, Kathala is a master, but you really shouldn't be struggling. I can do the mini smob chains solo, without a mob, on Kat, even with a yew and sporting an emmy ring/ Kandor set. Mobs are of little concern, unless I misport into Blight and end up with tons of mobs trailing behind me, but in that case just crossing a zone border fixes that.
Imo, compared to my other alts, Kat is still relatively OP in the soloing things department. My other, non-Tower channie has it a bit harder. My stabby Accepted has it a ton easier with some smobs, but I really don't play her because the aqps system absolutely disgusts me. Oh please, grovel grovel, may I do a small and insignificant task just for the sake of doing a task? *spit*
Imo, compared to my other alts, Kat is still relatively OP in the soloing things department. My other, non-Tower channie has it a bit harder. My stabby Accepted has it a ton easier with some smobs, but I really don't play her because the aqps system absolutely disgusts me. Oh please, grovel grovel, may I do a small and insignificant task just for the sake of doing a task? *spit*
Re: Quo vadis, the channeler class?
Kathala wrote:I think you're doing something wrong. I can solo things on Kathala that I can't solo on most of my other alts. Sure, Kathala is a master, but you really shouldn't be struggling. I can do the mini smob chains solo, without a mob, on Kat, even with a yew and sporting an emmy ring/ Kandor set. Mobs are of little concern, unless I misport into Blight and end up with tons of mobs trailing behind me, but in that case just crossing a zone border fixes that.
Imo, compared to my other alts, Kat is still relatively OP in the soloing things department. My other, non-Tower channie has it a bit harder. My stabby Accepted has it a ton easier with some smobs, but I really don't play her because the aqps system absolutely disgusts me. Oh please, grovel grovel, may I do a small and insignificant task just for the sake of doing a task? *spit*
Seconded, a channeler with clanned weaves can solo a disgusting amount of smobs very easily, even without clanned weaves you should be able to regear an fc pretty easily. I solo farm all the time and regear alts with fc because it’s easiest. Get a friend and spike some stuff dead if you can’t manage stabbing. Or find a stabber and heal/wvd them while they stab. You don’t need 6 people to smob just 1-2.
Re: Quo vadis, the channeler class?
Ah, the previous two posters make a good point. Make FCs unable to solo as many smobs!
Re: Quo vadis, the channeler class?
Fairly sure if you witness a Kin doing all those things on your Aes Sedai, you can mail either an immortal or another Kin player? about the break of RP and they get a strike on them. I agree with what you said about some Kin, but I think most are pretty decent at not doing anything blatantly in front of Aes Sedai.
Echoing others I think you just need more practice playing a channeler if you think the 280 max hps nerfed channelers so much they are unplayable now. Maybe seek out other Sedai who smob a lot on their own and see how they do it.
Echoing others I think you just need more practice playing a channeler if you think the 280 max hps nerfed channelers so much they are unplayable now. Maybe seek out other Sedai who smob a lot on their own and see how they do it.
Re: Quo vadis, the channeler class?
"I have a limited amount of free time, so every death is really annoying because of eq on unclanned channeler alts (and I don't have that much even on the clanned ones to eq everything from my personal rents. "
If you only have 30-45 minutes to play and you don't want to spend that smobbing (most smobbers will expect that much time commitment for their group) and your main alt is an FC then I can see how wandering around is tricky. Honestly the only thing that makes it work for me (on both sides) is people giving me eq :p Something like DSL is easy to hit for a bonded pair. The more serious players usually end up smobbing a bunch and everyone is nice/generous about regular eq on both sides that I've seen. Maybe it's been quiet on that front lately? Bonded gaidin make it easy mode :p
If you only have 30-45 minutes to play and you don't want to spend that smobbing (most smobbers will expect that much time commitment for their group) and your main alt is an FC then I can see how wandering around is tricky. Honestly the only thing that makes it work for me (on both sides) is people giving me eq :p Something like DSL is easy to hit for a bonded pair. The more serious players usually end up smobbing a bunch and everyone is nice/generous about regular eq on both sides that I've seen. Maybe it's been quiet on that front lately? Bonded gaidin make it easy mode :p