Justice

[Honey]

There are four people who are friendly with each other who have posted so far, you don't need to white knight one of them because you want to project all your issues onto them. Stop embarrassing yourself.

[isabel]

The funny thing is I've forgotten most people's alts and there's a sea of new names but Honey and alts are immediately identifiable with the way they talk down to other players.

[Honey]

The funny thing is I've forgotten most people's alts and there's a sea of new names but Honey and alts are immediately identifiable with the way they talk down to other players.

Perfect, I'm not trying to hide behind alts or saccharine bullshit. You may have been correct about Rig being terrible and wanting a defensive weapon because he's bad, but you always literally pick the one character type with zero offensive bonuses to focus in on in every other post!

[isabel]

Rig is one of my favourite people on the game but he will get disgusted with Justice bash in 2 mins after it changes to combo (and he will get bored with DS absolutely refusing to pk him in that setup) and then he will ask for it to be reverted back to abs - exactly as he did a few years ago.

I am trying to save him from pain and suffering.

PS - I'm sorry I don't post very seriously here but I do think that since I came back I saw that characters that loved abs before were now in dodge/fblade setups or nimble/combo - I think that says something. And it's not a coincidence that the ask is to change Justice away from abs.

[Bakar]

Wasn’t about defending just Isabel to be fair. I can’t count how many times I’ve heard players complain of the toxicity. And or the hierarchy of wotmud. There’s been way too many to list that have left specifically because of player issues. In many scopes not just attitudes. But alas it’s a moot point. We are left with what we are left with.

For what it’s worth aside from removal I’d vote it stay abs.

[Honey]

"I can't count how many times" is doing a lot of heavy lifting. Vague-posting about unnamed players, unnamed incidents, and an unspecified "hierarchy" isn't a contribution to the conversation -- it's just vibes-based grievance.

Let's be real though, it's especially funny on this particular post considering who is posting the idea and who is shitting on it. What "hierarchy" is Rig up against here?

Anyways, Rig also failed to account for wil creep. The last time Justice was combo, every LSer wasn't some variety of 18 16 16 19 19.

[isabel]

I appreciate that Bakar cares enough about the wotmud community to call out something that was a criticism of a player and not of their opinion or post on something.

To count how many times, one need only search for "toxic" on here and look at the numerous double digit threads about players directly leaving because of it.

[isabel]

I think Rig made very good and thought out points. I just don't agree.
Channies are also using justice these days and there's the wvd + combo channie to consider

Mainly though Justice being abs means it's more likely that a non master will use it for a boost than a bonused (or underbonused WB if you insist on that narrative) character keen to max their advantages.

[Honey]

I appreciate that Bakar cares enough about the wotmud community to call out something that was a criticism of a player and not of their opinion or post on something.

So would you find it toxic if a player posted something and someone randomly decided to make it about one of said player's alts and proceed to act like it's some "narrative" someone else is setting? Seems a tad hypocritical and deflecting, no?

To count how many times, one need only search for "toxic" on here and look at the numerous double digit threads about players directly leaving because of it.

Very rigorous method and all, but if you're not even going to throw in one throwaway line about Justice at the end of the post, it's maybe time to start a new topic (it's been awhile since we've had a concern-trolling "are players leaving?" type of post) or chat on the side.

edit - Will also note that the question of this game and player base being generally toxic wasn't and isn't in question (though, looking back on some of those threads, it is downright HILARIOUS how many of the most consistent complainers were also eventually outed as some of the biggest cheaters, but that's aside) -- but Bakar was implying something a lot more specific and that's what I wanted receipts on.

[Lexi]

I don’t even know why I’m posting this as I tend to stay out of bickering.

This post started out with a valid suggestion and has turned into personal he said, she said. Good grief.

Turn the other cheek and move on. Sometimes it’s not worth responding!