Cool thanks Jaster!
Also Ragyn sent me some great info about chokes/pois around gap/dusty so I will try to get some maps made about those zones and see how they look so thanks Ragyn too!
PK guide
Re: PK guide
If you need a hand walking through the different chokes and talk about ways to get past a block etc. let me know. But yeah best way is to just walk through the zone with the spreadsheet next to you. Depending on which client you use there should be plenty of maps available. If your client can't run maps, then I think wotmud wiki has screenshots of most zones, possibly also with the choke points highlighted. But I'd recommend switching to a client that supports maps - so much easier to get a feel for the zone if you have it visually in front of you while you learn spams, at least that was my experience, but don't rely on it too much, knowing a zone gives you the upper hand compared to relying on a map, especially in the popular PK areas where everyone has been running around for years.
If you are completely new up north, I'd recommend using a trolloc to get familiar with the northern zones, you can just hop on a level 1 and walk through the zones. Its a bit safer since you can "smell" if any human riding a horse enters the zone by using your "where" command. I'm sure there'll be people on who wouldn't mind walking you through the choke points, so you get a better feel for it.
Once you get familiar with the zone, but maybe don't feel confident to PK, you can always grab a friend to spar with in the zones, so you get a feel for running with someone chasing you. If you have a couple bored mates they could leave one guy blocking a choke and one guy chasing you, then you have to make your way from dusty up to Ruined Keep, trying to get past blocks different ways. Once you have the mechanics down and a better grasp of the zone, the only way to improve is just to PK a lot. During the off hours there's usually a lesser chance of running into full groups, but it probably still happens and can be frustrating while learning. I'd recommend keeping one set of re-equip at all times. So if you are on your last set, try to get a new set of re-eq before heading out to PK again. Although gear is somewhat plentiful these days, it still sucks to be naked if you are playing during off hours.
If you are completely new up north, I'd recommend using a trolloc to get familiar with the northern zones, you can just hop on a level 1 and walk through the zones. Its a bit safer since you can "smell" if any human riding a horse enters the zone by using your "where" command. I'm sure there'll be people on who wouldn't mind walking you through the choke points, so you get a better feel for it.
Once you get familiar with the zone, but maybe don't feel confident to PK, you can always grab a friend to spar with in the zones, so you get a feel for running with someone chasing you. If you have a couple bored mates they could leave one guy blocking a choke and one guy chasing you, then you have to make your way from dusty up to Ruined Keep, trying to get past blocks different ways. Once you have the mechanics down and a better grasp of the zone, the only way to improve is just to PK a lot. During the off hours there's usually a lesser chance of running into full groups, but it probably still happens and can be frustrating while learning. I'd recommend keeping one set of re-equip at all times. So if you are on your last set, try to get a new set of re-eq before heading out to PK again. Although gear is somewhat plentiful these days, it still sucks to be naked if you are playing during off hours.
Re: PK guide
You can find all those things on http://lyren.me
Re: PK guide
Here's a random smattering of thoughts from yours truly. Get paranoid people!
-This is about ...being overexposed - not knowing how much risk you are taking.
-Highly dependent upon your skill level/knowledge of game mechanics, zone, etc. The same player in the same situation may not be exposed.
-Being AFK or playing on an unreliable link is a poor strategy. I hear people have been playing on their phones now - seems insane to me, but to each their own.
-A lot of very common behaviors are forms of being "easy meat"
-Lyren's guide above discusses essentially how for the lack of -1- item you could potentially allowing yourself to be easily killed. Be prepared. 1 lantern is not enough. Don't leave a city with an empty skin - recognize some terrains and zones will literally eat your moves. Understand what survival does. Understand how notice affects your move usage. Everything is new at first and therefore you are exposed - but its good. We've all been there.
-For whatever, reason many humans choose to sit in "City Squares" - as far as I can tell MOST of these rooms are not actually the place where a player should sit, rest, afk etc. Some do have the advantage of being no hide. Many of them have no other advantages - they are ..within a city and often that isn't enough. TV square is very popular - the mob density there in my experience is low. Experienced raiders are not going to be intimidated by the fact that you are in Tar Valon. If you haven't fought a channeler opponent before it will shock you how quickly they + a basher can kill you. Caemlyn Central Square is another terrible room - 3 of its exits are no ride. The mob density again is intermittent. If trollocs attack you in this room and you are mounted - 3/4 of the exits will cause you to fail your flee. When a fade leads in 3-4 trollocs to hit you in this room you are going to experience a wotmud nightmare - panic and "autowimpy"-overflee, pounding your keyboard with flee and directions, while you stay in the same room and die getting a strange message about your horse being exhausted.
-On the subject of who will be murdering you in this game - exceptionally experienced fades, dreadlords, trollocs, same-side stabbers, random killers, random male and female channelers, Seanchan of every variation and class including channelers, people looking for their first kill who see something they like and don't care about the consequences, people who aren't bothered by your AFK or linkless status etc.
-Its very important to recognize what will come to your aid when you are dealing with the above. In general, the vast majority of human mobs, ancient trees, wolves, and ogier will assist you against opposite race players ie. Trollocs, Fades, Dreadlords, and probably human players flagged "known darkfriend".
-For our purposes there are now 2 races - Seanchan have been merged into human. Notice that these above (darkside) encompasses a fraction of the things that will attack you - your own who list is crawling with killers. I'm sort of purposely overstating this, but get paranoid - the unseen dagger you don't expect is the one you won't have planned for.
-Same race ie. murders, MCs, Seanchan, "villains" - anyone who is "bad" and wants to kill you and shows up on your who list will only be attacked by things that have warranted them (the universe of things assisting you against other humans is smaller than against darkside). In general, that means mobs that are clearly associated with nations that have warranting abilities. So if a Seanchan tries to kill you in Caemlyn - blacksmiths and merchants guards won't assist you, nor will ogier and wolves - you'll need things with names like Caemlyn guards or Defender of the Rose crown. That essentially goes for ..everywhere you go. The opponent must be wanted by the locality for the city to defend you. Fal Dara, Maradon, Cairhien, Tar Valon, Far Madding, Caemlyn, Tear, Illian, Amador, Bandar Eban is my quicky summary of places that can warrant (and in ..general serve as Justice clans [huge asterisk next to Amador] and who potentially have mobs that would come to your aid.
-A brand new murderer potentially is going to start out not-warranted everywhere they go so there will be a time table where nothing will assist you against them. They literally could kill you in front of Queen Morgase proclaiming themselves servants of the Empress and the mobs won't lift a finger. In these situations safety is not found in mobs, but in your fellow players and hopefully cities where said player is already warranted. Keep in mind same-side killers will be able to see you on where and hear your communications. Your requests for help may actually be giving them information about your situation. In fact, your best friend could be a fresh horse and and a run towards somewhere wide open or towards supporting players.
-Joining a clan can provide a measure of protection in your home town/zones though your mileage will vary. For example, Dragonsworn cannot warrant, but their mobs will assist them against anyone who attacks them.
-Back on the easy meat train. Be paranoid. Resting/sleeping in rooms in cities that are "hideable" - you're exposed. You're 1 shot away from dead. I don't like TV Square or Caemlyn Square but resting on the ground 2 rooms away from them is even worse.
-Counting on mobs in a city to assist you when they won't - exposed. For example - sitting in one of the shops with a door in Tar Valon and a Seanchan comes in - its very likely the TV guards ie. Valon guardsman would attack the Seanchan, but the merchant guards and shop will not.
-Sitting in a door that is not locked - better have a good reason. In general, don't go into a door you don't have an alias to open and close ahead of time - each of these aliases should be 1 (2 max) button clicks to trigger. Doors often have different names on the inside and the outside. My primary door alias is ` and 1 - for close and open. This all sounds obviously ridiculous paranoid, but the heart of many players' PK strategies is get opponent in door so they can't escape and then kill them.
-Heck, you think doors are crazy - literally the rooms you sit in leading up to a battle may determine the outcome or your ability to run away. Darkside players long ago recognized that the room called "4e" which is 2n, 4e of Malkier Gate serves as a choke point for blocking humans trying to escape to Fal Dara. This same block can be used by humans to try and prevent trolls from escaping to winding. Amusingly though, I sometimes see human use this room as an actual "regroup" point - why would you regroup at a darkside favored choke? Every room has its own dangers - learn to recognize them. That room 1-exit room with a mob or 2 to assist you may actually be a room its hard to flee from. You're sitting in an "smob" with a group because someone had to pee when darkside hits - wouldn't you rather have been sitting outside the building riding your horse with more OB and the mounted-bash-bonus?
-The mechanics of Hide and Notice when fighting opposite race are pretty straight forward - there's a notice percentage that is highly effective (its about ..90ish) and combinations of kill dark/human or kill h.dark/human (with notice on) when used appropriately is highly prophylactic. I'm rereading this as a second go and laughing - opposite race stabbers are highly dangerous, but the mechanics of fighting them is relatively straight forward - engage them (you don't have to know their name before hand) and kill them (or more likely - be annoyed by them or die to them or leave in frustration).
-Fighting same-race stabbing players is a NIGHTMARE. Try to become aware of who would want to kill you and preset aliases ahead of time (use ..macros or targeting scripts ie. target murder-> leads to an alias being set to kill murderer and kill h.murderer). If you find yourself in a room with a hidden lifeform you can't just kill kill h.hidden - if its same race you need to know who the player is to attack them otherwise they are likely to get a stab off you. Walk out of the room - they have to complete a "timer" for their attack to finish - don't be there when it finishes. Spam "look" or "where" to try and catch them as they enter the room before they've typed hide. Use no hides - rooms that essentially interfere with the hide skill and prevent players from concealing themselves.
-Recognize the power of the build you are playing. As you play the game more and level up you may reach the point where you start to think - wow, my character gets the job done - I fight back, I can kill things. Nothing will beat you down faster than another player. Try to come to recognize what works and what doesn't. Recently we were given an amazing opportunity - a coded explanation of how bash works against dodge. I would encourage players to open up Stark's calculator and literally plug their characters values in against different opponent levels of dodge - 130, 140, 150, 155. Nothing is more frustrating than being a bashing player who can't seat a defensive player. in time you'll come to recognize what constitutes good defensive gear and good bashing weapons. What I can tell you with certainty is those high tier numbers (and higher still) can be reached by experienced players who will regularly have access to that level of gear. Dodge + basic rares + 19 dex + 99dodge + minimal weight + ARMOR (+10db) - breaks 150db easily (I think it hits ..154-156 without uniques). Plug that in against your basic heavy weapon and you may not like the answer. Dismount and you'll like it less. Have a plan to recognize when you are up against one of those scenarios. Conversely, recognize that your 120-130 DB can can literally be bashed by mid-level 1 handed weapons! Long time players of the game will recognize that Jestin (and many others) start off all fights by looking at their opponent. He's sizing you up to adjust his play accordingly. Mirror the habits of highly successful players. Follow them and see how they move.
-You are going to die a lot. The goal is to learn something from each of these encounters. There are highly successful players throughout the history of the game who within 1-2 years of playing became top caliber PKers. Ask someone to mentor you. Reread your logs to see what you did wrong or right and how you could have changed things. Start each fight off by being calm. Recognize that you live and die in this game by ..milliseconds - one additional click or command could have been the thing that won the fight for you or got you away. Its a team sport - seems like a lot of people are going to audio communication, but you still need to work on effectively communicating with other players. I'm dead is less valuable to your team than - trapped SW corner sted.
-Drop from your vocab words like "gank" - the wotmud word of choice to describe dissatisfaction when more opponents show up than you were expecting in a situation where you possibly exposed yourself and ultimately die. No one likes getting smashed during a 1 on 1, going deep into enemy territory to ultimately find they had an army waiting for you, hitting an opponents patrol only to find they were waiting for you with a trap set. You'll ultimately do all these things to other people. You'll find in time that the deadly situation that couldn't escape may in fact not be that deadly. You'll find players predictable. You'll establish your own idea of what's fun or what's a win. Is it fun killing another player in 1 bash or with 1 stab? It comes with a certain measure of satisfaction, but often the battle is over at that point. Its all really about attitude - try and keep a good attitude. This is an old game. Its got flaws. There's things that the Imms would love to fix. Do what you gotta do.
-Repress the urge to share a log with an angry addendum about the unfairness of your death (don't blame your team mates either - that doesn't do anything for anyone) - ask for help or ask what could you have done differently. Most deaths can be summarized in some combination of the following - you paniced, you played poorly, the other player knew the zone better than you, the other player was able to rapidly deliver more damage than you expected. While this is occurring you will often believe you are "lagged" - my connection is dying, my commands aren't going through etc. Its not your link. When you enter a room and another player engages you, you must flee to leave that room, as you flee you build up fleelag, as you die you tend to build up even more lag because players often don't control their "autowimpy" (a set point where the game tries to protect you by fleeing you out of the room, but it also creates lag because each hit triggers a flee which builds up your "flee lag" - that's a mouthful). So you're trying to flee, but you're commands aren't going through because you can't leave a room with direction commands if you are engaged - rinse, repeat, dead. You felt frozen, but really the issue what you couldn't break free to let your commands go through. Flees also tend to fail as fleelag builds up - you flee but you don't leave. Very possibly your opponent got a bash off during the lag because you stayed in the room and then none of your commands will go through because you are on the ground dying. Heck of a game! When we die here we die hard.
-This is about ...being overexposed - not knowing how much risk you are taking.
-Highly dependent upon your skill level/knowledge of game mechanics, zone, etc. The same player in the same situation may not be exposed.
-Being AFK or playing on an unreliable link is a poor strategy. I hear people have been playing on their phones now - seems insane to me, but to each their own.
-A lot of very common behaviors are forms of being "easy meat"
-Lyren's guide above discusses essentially how for the lack of -1- item you could potentially allowing yourself to be easily killed. Be prepared. 1 lantern is not enough. Don't leave a city with an empty skin - recognize some terrains and zones will literally eat your moves. Understand what survival does. Understand how notice affects your move usage. Everything is new at first and therefore you are exposed - but its good. We've all been there.
-For whatever, reason many humans choose to sit in "City Squares" - as far as I can tell MOST of these rooms are not actually the place where a player should sit, rest, afk etc. Some do have the advantage of being no hide. Many of them have no other advantages - they are ..within a city and often that isn't enough. TV square is very popular - the mob density there in my experience is low. Experienced raiders are not going to be intimidated by the fact that you are in Tar Valon. If you haven't fought a channeler opponent before it will shock you how quickly they + a basher can kill you. Caemlyn Central Square is another terrible room - 3 of its exits are no ride. The mob density again is intermittent. If trollocs attack you in this room and you are mounted - 3/4 of the exits will cause you to fail your flee. When a fade leads in 3-4 trollocs to hit you in this room you are going to experience a wotmud nightmare - panic and "autowimpy"-overflee, pounding your keyboard with flee and directions, while you stay in the same room and die getting a strange message about your horse being exhausted.
-On the subject of who will be murdering you in this game - exceptionally experienced fades, dreadlords, trollocs, same-side stabbers, random killers, random male and female channelers, Seanchan of every variation and class including channelers, people looking for their first kill who see something they like and don't care about the consequences, people who aren't bothered by your AFK or linkless status etc.
-Its very important to recognize what will come to your aid when you are dealing with the above. In general, the vast majority of human mobs, ancient trees, wolves, and ogier will assist you against opposite race players ie. Trollocs, Fades, Dreadlords, and probably human players flagged "known darkfriend".
-For our purposes there are now 2 races - Seanchan have been merged into human. Notice that these above (darkside) encompasses a fraction of the things that will attack you - your own who list is crawling with killers. I'm sort of purposely overstating this, but get paranoid - the unseen dagger you don't expect is the one you won't have planned for.
-Same race ie. murders, MCs, Seanchan, "villains" - anyone who is "bad" and wants to kill you and shows up on your who list will only be attacked by things that have warranted them (the universe of things assisting you against other humans is smaller than against darkside). In general, that means mobs that are clearly associated with nations that have warranting abilities. So if a Seanchan tries to kill you in Caemlyn - blacksmiths and merchants guards won't assist you, nor will ogier and wolves - you'll need things with names like Caemlyn guards or Defender of the Rose crown. That essentially goes for ..everywhere you go. The opponent must be wanted by the locality for the city to defend you. Fal Dara, Maradon, Cairhien, Tar Valon, Far Madding, Caemlyn, Tear, Illian, Amador, Bandar Eban is my quicky summary of places that can warrant (and in ..general serve as Justice clans [huge asterisk next to Amador] and who potentially have mobs that would come to your aid.
-A brand new murderer potentially is going to start out not-warranted everywhere they go so there will be a time table where nothing will assist you against them. They literally could kill you in front of Queen Morgase proclaiming themselves servants of the Empress and the mobs won't lift a finger. In these situations safety is not found in mobs, but in your fellow players and hopefully cities where said player is already warranted. Keep in mind same-side killers will be able to see you on where and hear your communications. Your requests for help may actually be giving them information about your situation. In fact, your best friend could be a fresh horse and and a run towards somewhere wide open or towards supporting players.
-Joining a clan can provide a measure of protection in your home town/zones though your mileage will vary. For example, Dragonsworn cannot warrant, but their mobs will assist them against anyone who attacks them.
-Back on the easy meat train. Be paranoid. Resting/sleeping in rooms in cities that are "hideable" - you're exposed. You're 1 shot away from dead. I don't like TV Square or Caemlyn Square but resting on the ground 2 rooms away from them is even worse.
-Counting on mobs in a city to assist you when they won't - exposed. For example - sitting in one of the shops with a door in Tar Valon and a Seanchan comes in - its very likely the TV guards ie. Valon guardsman would attack the Seanchan, but the merchant guards and shop will not.
-Sitting in a door that is not locked - better have a good reason. In general, don't go into a door you don't have an alias to open and close ahead of time - each of these aliases should be 1 (2 max) button clicks to trigger. Doors often have different names on the inside and the outside. My primary door alias is ` and 1 - for close and open. This all sounds obviously ridiculous paranoid, but the heart of many players' PK strategies is get opponent in door so they can't escape and then kill them.
-Heck, you think doors are crazy - literally the rooms you sit in leading up to a battle may determine the outcome or your ability to run away. Darkside players long ago recognized that the room called "4e" which is 2n, 4e of Malkier Gate serves as a choke point for blocking humans trying to escape to Fal Dara. This same block can be used by humans to try and prevent trolls from escaping to winding. Amusingly though, I sometimes see human use this room as an actual "regroup" point - why would you regroup at a darkside favored choke? Every room has its own dangers - learn to recognize them. That room 1-exit room with a mob or 2 to assist you may actually be a room its hard to flee from. You're sitting in an "smob" with a group because someone had to pee when darkside hits - wouldn't you rather have been sitting outside the building riding your horse with more OB and the mounted-bash-bonus?
-The mechanics of Hide and Notice when fighting opposite race are pretty straight forward - there's a notice percentage that is highly effective (its about ..90ish) and combinations of kill dark/human or kill h.dark/human (with notice on) when used appropriately is highly prophylactic. I'm rereading this as a second go and laughing - opposite race stabbers are highly dangerous, but the mechanics of fighting them is relatively straight forward - engage them (you don't have to know their name before hand) and kill them (or more likely - be annoyed by them or die to them or leave in frustration).
-Fighting same-race stabbing players is a NIGHTMARE. Try to become aware of who would want to kill you and preset aliases ahead of time (use ..macros or targeting scripts ie. target murder-> leads to an alias being set to kill murderer and kill h.murderer). If you find yourself in a room with a hidden lifeform you can't just kill kill h.hidden - if its same race you need to know who the player is to attack them otherwise they are likely to get a stab off you. Walk out of the room - they have to complete a "timer" for their attack to finish - don't be there when it finishes. Spam "look" or "where" to try and catch them as they enter the room before they've typed hide. Use no hides - rooms that essentially interfere with the hide skill and prevent players from concealing themselves.
-Recognize the power of the build you are playing. As you play the game more and level up you may reach the point where you start to think - wow, my character gets the job done - I fight back, I can kill things. Nothing will beat you down faster than another player. Try to come to recognize what works and what doesn't. Recently we were given an amazing opportunity - a coded explanation of how bash works against dodge. I would encourage players to open up Stark's calculator and literally plug their characters values in against different opponent levels of dodge - 130, 140, 150, 155. Nothing is more frustrating than being a bashing player who can't seat a defensive player. in time you'll come to recognize what constitutes good defensive gear and good bashing weapons. What I can tell you with certainty is those high tier numbers (and higher still) can be reached by experienced players who will regularly have access to that level of gear. Dodge + basic rares + 19 dex + 99dodge + minimal weight + ARMOR (+10db) - breaks 150db easily (I think it hits ..154-156 without uniques). Plug that in against your basic heavy weapon and you may not like the answer. Dismount and you'll like it less. Have a plan to recognize when you are up against one of those scenarios. Conversely, recognize that your 120-130 DB can can literally be bashed by mid-level 1 handed weapons! Long time players of the game will recognize that Jestin (and many others) start off all fights by looking at their opponent. He's sizing you up to adjust his play accordingly. Mirror the habits of highly successful players. Follow them and see how they move.
-You are going to die a lot. The goal is to learn something from each of these encounters. There are highly successful players throughout the history of the game who within 1-2 years of playing became top caliber PKers. Ask someone to mentor you. Reread your logs to see what you did wrong or right and how you could have changed things. Start each fight off by being calm. Recognize that you live and die in this game by ..milliseconds - one additional click or command could have been the thing that won the fight for you or got you away. Its a team sport - seems like a lot of people are going to audio communication, but you still need to work on effectively communicating with other players. I'm dead is less valuable to your team than - trapped SW corner sted.
-Drop from your vocab words like "gank" - the wotmud word of choice to describe dissatisfaction when more opponents show up than you were expecting in a situation where you possibly exposed yourself and ultimately die. No one likes getting smashed during a 1 on 1, going deep into enemy territory to ultimately find they had an army waiting for you, hitting an opponents patrol only to find they were waiting for you with a trap set. You'll ultimately do all these things to other people. You'll find in time that the deadly situation that couldn't escape may in fact not be that deadly. You'll find players predictable. You'll establish your own idea of what's fun or what's a win. Is it fun killing another player in 1 bash or with 1 stab? It comes with a certain measure of satisfaction, but often the battle is over at that point. Its all really about attitude - try and keep a good attitude. This is an old game. Its got flaws. There's things that the Imms would love to fix. Do what you gotta do.
-Repress the urge to share a log with an angry addendum about the unfairness of your death (don't blame your team mates either - that doesn't do anything for anyone) - ask for help or ask what could you have done differently. Most deaths can be summarized in some combination of the following - you paniced, you played poorly, the other player knew the zone better than you, the other player was able to rapidly deliver more damage than you expected. While this is occurring you will often believe you are "lagged" - my connection is dying, my commands aren't going through etc. Its not your link. When you enter a room and another player engages you, you must flee to leave that room, as you flee you build up fleelag, as you die you tend to build up even more lag because players often don't control their "autowimpy" (a set point where the game tries to protect you by fleeing you out of the room, but it also creates lag because each hit triggers a flee which builds up your "flee lag" - that's a mouthful). So you're trying to flee, but you're commands aren't going through because you can't leave a room with direction commands if you are engaged - rinse, repeat, dead. You felt frozen, but really the issue what you couldn't break free to let your commands go through. Flees also tend to fail as fleelag builds up - you flee but you don't leave. Very possibly your opponent got a bash off during the lag because you stayed in the room and then none of your commands will go through because you are on the ground dying. Heck of a game! When we die here we die hard.
Re: PK guide
When in doubt, listen to Eol is a pretty good heuristic for most things concerning wotmud, this thread included.
Re: PK guide
Hey thanks for all that info guys! I'm thinking once my exam is done this week I may start working on a wiki page with this info and see how it looks
One more (sorry) question - someone said something about being able to get to know the zones while offline with zmud, how would that work? I don't use it but would download it for that purpose haha
One more (sorry) question - someone said something about being able to get to know the zones while offline with zmud, how would that work? I don't use it but would download it for that purpose haha
Re: PK guide
Start up the client, single click select the character profile, click "offline" instead of "connect." This opens the window so you can load scripts and loads your map and you can edit rooms/ room names/ and you can put PK names for rooms so they display on your map too.Skurk wrote:One more (sorry) question - someone said something about being able to get to know the zones while offline with zmud, how would that work? I don't use it but would download it for that purpose haha
Re: PK guide
Oooh yeah I did it, the map from Lyren's site for cmud also had most of the chokes and points of interest marked so together that's really helpful