Look into % for large gemstones

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mildred
Posts: 4
Joined: Sun Feb 27, 2022 10:13 pm

Look into % for large gemstones

Post by mildred » Sun Apr 03, 2022 2:07 pm

Could we get the imms to look into the percentage for getting large gemstones? I spent a good portion of my day digging, sieving, and gemcutting and ended up with 1 small emerald and 10 small rubies. Considering the danger and weight of the buckets of soil and the long amount of time it takes for sieving and at the gemcutter, I just wonder if 0 for 11 yield is the intended ratio (yes, I know, random, but still).

Thank you for your consideration.

Elysia
Posts: 7908
Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2015 1:29 pm

Re: Look into % for large gemstones

Post by Elysia » Sun Apr 03, 2022 3:03 pm

That's just bad luck, tbh, which can happen with any roll based system. You should've walked away with like 2 large gems, but RNGesus didn't favor you that day. It happens.

Viva
Posts: 114
Joined: Tue Jun 16, 2020 4:16 pm

Re: Look into % for large gemstones

Post by Viva » Thu Apr 07, 2022 6:02 pm

I feel lucky if I get 1 large to 10 small... those numbers are pretty normal in my experience.

Stomp
Posts: 75
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2017 7:25 am

Re: Look into % for large gemstones

Post by Stomp » Mon Apr 18, 2022 1:52 pm

Can we get this upped slightly please?

mildred
Posts: 4
Joined: Sun Feb 27, 2022 10:13 pm

Re: Look into % for large gemstones

Post by mildred » Mon Apr 18, 2022 8:49 pm

Stomp and Viva, thanks for posting follow-ups, it reminded me that I had wanted to look into my metrics. This is just meant to be a discussion point, not saying what is right or wrong. Across my characters, these are my gemcutting metrics.

I dug for buckets of soil 514 times, taking 102.8 minutes and generating 183 buckets. Meaning a success rate of 35.6% and on average a bucket every 34 seconds. I depleted the sediment 36 times, but that does not mean 183 / 36 gives 5 buckets per sediment on average since sometimes I wouldn't finish the sediment before moving on.

I sieved 181 buckets of soil, having to WASH SIEVE 1167 times, which found 120 raw gemstones and 57 times finding none, there were 4 times where it was interupted by something (LIKE GHAST!!). This took 289.76 minutes total, where the average time to complete a cycle is 1.6 minutes. This shows a 66% success rate for getting a raw gem, and on average 2.4 minutes to get one.

The gemcutter cut 115 raw stones into gems, taking 212.75 minutes, and made 94 small stones and 21 large stones. This is a success rate of 22.34%, taking on average 10 minutes of gemcutting to get a large stone assuming you have enough raw gems. Or a success rate of 8.6% in terms of how many buckets create a successful large stone.

The gemologist took 7.8 minutes to net 4,230 gold crowns. I don't know how much gold the gemologist has before running out. 4 times it ran out after paying for 2-4 gems worth. One time 7 gems worth, and one time after paying for 11 gems, which may be the most current as I think it was shortly after a boot. So nothing conclusive on how much money he has.

Therefore, it took 612.81 minutes (or 10.21 hours) of moboling to get 21 large stones and 4,230 gold. Without taking into account the transport time it takes to get the gems to the sieve stones, the raw gems to far madding, or holding onto small gems for enough reboots to sell them off. On average this comes to 6.9 gold per minute (or 414 gold an hour) of moboling (not accounting for transport time) and 29.18 minutes of mobol to get a single large gemstone.

It could very well be that this is the intended amount of effort for the rewards, the numbers do point to a ~20% success rate like you said. But I think the main complaint is that it take so long to work through all the mobol, and with the sites depleting and the weight of everything, you don't get to benefit from the law of large numbers for quite a commitment of time.

Do what you will of this information, I'm just analytical in nature and these things could be collected in logs and timed pretty easy.

These are the rough times it takes to do each part:
It takes 12 seconds per dig
It takes 22 seconds to start the first sieving
It takes 12 seconds to sieve a sieveIt takes 111 seconds to get the gemcutter to
It takes 5 seconds for the gemologist to give coins

Aloisa
Posts: 968
Joined: Tue May 30, 2017 8:24 pm

Re: Look into % for large gemstones

Post by Aloisa » Mon Apr 18, 2022 9:34 pm

Mining sounds really not fun.

Weir
Posts: 623
Joined: Sun Mar 22, 2015 12:44 am

Re: Look into % for large gemstones

Post by Weir » Mon Apr 18, 2022 9:55 pm

At the same time, it is just RNG. Did 4 buckets a couple days ago, got 2 raw gems. Then turned those 2 raw into 2 large.

The thing that gets me, while I do appreciate the effort involved design-wise, some of the mobol just feels needlessly long, elongating the process.

mildred
Posts: 4
Joined: Sun Feb 27, 2022 10:13 pm

Re: Look into % for large gemstones

Post by mildred » Fri Apr 22, 2022 3:52 pm

That's what I like about the metrics and showing numbers. For a large number of gems it proves that 20% is roughly the % for large gemstones, which is what the immortals expected. So my numbers do not support changing the percentage of success for the gemcutting, which I what I initially asked for. But for cost-benefit of spending time on this craft, I think we should look into the other numbers in regards to how long it takes.

Today I had another incident of spending a lot of time on this craft and getting 0 of 9 large gemstones. The deposits depleted after 4, 2, 3, and 5 buckets (2 pops each), I believe. Yes, it is also random, but this is what happens commonly. With such a small number of buckets per session, it is common that if you are logging on with only an hour or so that there's a good chance you'll be out of luck. If that level of randomness is the intent, then fine, it it defensible to let randomness have its say. But can we at least reduce the time it takes? Using rough numbers, it took about an hour of mobol, not taking into account waiting for a repop or travel time.

Yes, there are many aspects to this. Like that they likely don't want a huge influx of gemstones, that getting gemstones shouldn't be guarenteed, and that the randomness is working in the manner it is intended. I'm just hoping maybe for some tweaks to the amount of time we have to spend on something that sometimes seems like wasted effort and time, where the only answer is that you got unlucky. It has been getting me log in to get the ingredients and do the crafting, so far at least.

Thank you for letting me bring up my side. I'm not trying to be critical of this at all, I love this crafting system, and really appreciate the immortals for developing it and the crafting systems that use these ingredients.

Happy hunting.

Fermin
Posts: 453
Joined: Sat Sep 10, 2016 12:16 pm

Re: Look into % for large gemstones

Post by Fermin » Fri Apr 22, 2022 4:51 pm

If you make gem mining easier then the large gemstones will lose their value to other players. I've mined a bit to craft and it is certainly a bit of time to get what you want and in general I will pay for a gemstone but if it is easier I would just mine...honestly looks like a decent way to make gold...

Reyne
Posts: 1418
Joined: Wed Mar 08, 2017 2:46 am

Re: Look into % for large gemstones

Post by Reyne » Sat Oct 01, 2022 4:23 pm

After a few months; I think the percentages are more or less fine for me.

I will say that some of these locations have odious amounts of mobs running around which makes everything take much longer if you are solo (Illian has so many lions and bears). Add some rats and ravens near the mining areas instead imo. I only saw one rat while mining emeralds this morning. Maybe I just got lucky. Having to melee down a dozen lions and bears is just annoying in terms of the added time involved.

In general it's a good way to make some money when the game is quiet, though.

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