Wheel of Time MUD

If you were good at playing a rogue a week ago you'll be good next week. You just won't be able to spam stab 100 times in a row in 1 room. That's the only thing that's been truly lost. The class remains highly survivable. 99% hide remains ridiculous. Notice doesn't counter sneak. The stab landing rate was just upped for those willing to pay the price. Players who are good at killing others will always have more than enough vials.

If the Imms really want to force survival on you they'll change how vials give moves (set humans and trolls to be equal) and make all hidden doors require some search.

From practicing and exploring the practice trainer the low levels of survival are very affordable. Anyone on darkside willing to toss a few practices should be able to get a little bit more regen. I still hate how the 13% "practice tree" gives level 0 with the first practice. Ugh.

I've literally felt darkside needed a move upping desperately for years. Against that though I had to balance the unbelievable explosiveness of a troll if they started with full moves and had a vial. Don't like who comes out Fal Dara. Give them the finger and run to TKD. Whole thing is kind of funny though. When we'd talk practices years ago we'd say trolls don't need ride or survival. Ha.

@aureus going 93 93 96 is only 1% less land rate than taking 99.

Womp womp. Fantastic!

Who remembers when they needed camo as well and didn’t have 2h daggers? I remembers!

Pepperidge farm remembers

I like how they "wanted to make tradeoffs meaningful" by nuking DS rogues till there's only one viable PK setup for DS rogues now: shitty combo with shitty stab.

I can afford level 4 survival, pull 143+ db, and my stab pracs are fine.

hide (99%)
sneak (94%)
dodge (99%)
attack (68%)
backstab (92%)
short blades (92%)
track (13%)
notice (88%)
camouflage (39%)
ranger sneak (37%)
survival Level 3 (46%)
shield parry (85%)

Has been working well for me. I should probably drop shield parry more and get more survival

Nocturnal wrote: ↑

Wed Mar 16, 2022 5:08 pm

I like how they "wanted to make tradeoffs meaningful" by nuking DS rogues till there's only one viable PK setup for DS rogues now: shitty combo with shitty stab.

The proper term is re-eq smob for your hunter/war alt so that you can be useful in pvp 5 mins later!

also means that you need to be superstatted to at least 5 point total higher than pre rolled in order to make pracs work out.

The challenge comes to going about making stab be a meaningful choice with prac-related consequences to chars whose main benefit is prac related bonuses that let them do a lot more than normal chars in the first place, while not effectively gimping everybody else. A warrior can be easily built to be useful without needing any rogue skills prac'd up. A rogue really can't -- at least, not without getting either kick or shield parry to at least 60%-70% so they have more utility than a master mob that can spam and keep doors closed. I would argue that making dirks and other 2h dagger options with defense on par with other 2h defensive weapons made no-stab would've left rogues with more combat options and more interesting trade offs with the play style --- switching from the moonhilted dirks to the tri-bladed to try a sneaky stab with the clumsly lag having crappy defense gives risky yet playable options, meanwhile removing options further pushes the class into a one-trick pony and makes all rogues basically the same when trying to maximize the usefulness of the build (without willfully playing gimped or otherwise definitively worse builds)

The changes to make stab more of an all-in prac intensive thing would be handled a lot better if rogues had more combat timer options that work in all situations (exping, smobbing, group smob/PK) or in general, as the case is with throw... farming/losing projectiles and their management is quite the pain in the rear, and then you need to worry about the target running away and keeping all your crap. More meaningful and viable options to stab builds, but that's another discussion all together and a *lot* more work to implement and get worked out and balanced.

Rogues are the best melee characters in the game.