Why are absolutely any chances of enjoying PvE being destroyed?

[halfhand]

I'll just put in my support for the old heralds. They were a great way of making the world smaller by getting different clans together (and nonclanned got the benefit of being able to smob). You have a lot of people who would not be interacted mostly getting together for some low-key low-investment fun with small tangeble beneift at the end.

Nowadays to a herald group, I would only do it on my Master Sedai in a high power Gating/zonesense group, and I don't even see the point. I would never do it on any other character especially not a CoL trying to start from Amador going a billion zones to end up in the Blight. Nowadays PvE is basically a Tower group, forgetting that there are plenty of players that should not be dependent on a Tower group.

I get the sentiment in trying to draw LS and DS together in interactions, but you first you need to have an environment when you foster LS numbers.

[Dartes]

If you're in Illian and your smobgroup has a Companion with it, you have a chance at a qp.
If you're in Great Forest and your smobgroup has a Forester with it, you have a chance at a qp.
If you're in Andor and your smobgroup has a Queens Guard with it, you have a chance at a qp.

This is actually a really creative idea for encouraging group diversity. I like it.

[Drybones]

Just curious, if a known DF RP's with people, are they awarded aqps for logs/rpkudos etc? Might provide another outlet for their wickedness, but the whole who list might just rpkudos them to remort just to get them off of globals

[Masaj]

I'll just put in my support for the old heralds. They were a great way of making the world smaller by getting different clans together (and nonclanned got the benefit of being able to smob). You have a lot of people who would not be interacted mostly getting together for some low-key low-investment fun with small tangeble beneift at the end.

Nowadays to a herald group, I would only do it on my Master Sedai in a high power Gating/zonesense group, and I don't even see the point. I would never do it on any other character especially not a CoL trying to start from Amador going a billion zones to end up in the Blight. Nowadays PvE is basically a Tower group, forgetting that there are plenty of players that should not be dependent on a Tower group.

I get the sentiment in trying to draw LS and DS together in interactions, but you first you need to have an environment when you foster LS numbers.

Here's a thought: why not just re-implement Heralds and specifically exclude Tower, Dragonsworn, and any other clan that has channelers with clanned weaves from awards on this type of stuff? We have a tendency to provide blanket solutions to specific problems.

The issue is always that if you make it easier for normal characters, you make it that much easier for the AS/Warder that are going to power farm. If you want to chill on LS and do Heralds and get rewards, maybe it should be a reward for contributing to the diversity of the game rather than exclusively for being on the best characters to power farm TPs/QPs on.

If you're in Illian and your smobgroup has a Companion with it, you have a chance at a qp.
If you're in Great Forest and your smobgroup has a Forester with it, you have a chance at a qp.
If you're in Andor and your smobgroup has a Queens Guard with it, you have a chance at a qp.

This is actually a really creative idea for encouraging group diversity. I like it.

+1 - Could even maybe also base chance for award on how many *different* clans are represented. So, for example, if you're doing a smob in Illian and you have a Companion with you and you have members of three other clans in tow, it increases your odds.

I think this would also encourage people to cycle off their power alts and populate LS and, in the era of prerolled stats and xp scalps, that's not the most unreasonable ask to take advantage of a fun opportunity. At least that's how some of us with 10+ masters have entertained ourselves for years and years when a side/alt feels a little played out.

[Dartes]

I'll just put in my support for the old heralds. They were a great way of making the world smaller by getting different clans together (and nonclanned got the benefit of being able to smob). You have a lot of people who would not be interacted mostly getting together for some low-key low-investment fun with small tangeble beneift at the end.

Nowadays to a herald group, I would only do it on my Master Sedai in a high power Gating/zonesense group, and I don't even see the point. I would never do it on any other character especially not a CoL trying to start from Amador going a billion zones to end up in the Blight. Nowadays PvE is basically a Tower group, forgetting that there are plenty of players that should not be dependent on a Tower group.

I get the sentiment in trying to draw LS and DS together in interactions, but you first you need to have an environment when you foster LS numbers.

Here's a thought: why not just re-implement Heralds and specifically exclude Tower, Dragonsworn, and any other clan that has channelers with clanned weaves from awards on this type of stuff? We have a tendency to provide blanket solutions to specific problems.

The issue is always that if you make it easier for normal characters, you make it that much easier for the AS/Warder that are going to power farm. If you want to chill on LS and do Heralds and get rewards, maybe it should be a reward for contributing to the diversity of the game rather than exclusively for being on the best characters to power farm TPs/QPs on.

If you're in Illian and your smobgroup has a Companion with it, you have a chance at a qp.
If you're in Great Forest and your smobgroup has a Forester with it, you have a chance at a qp.
If you're in Andor and your smobgroup has a Queens Guard with it, you have a chance at a qp.

This is actually a really creative idea for encouraging group diversity. I like it.

+1 - Could even maybe also base chance for award on how many *different* clans are represented. So, for example, if you're doing a smob in Illian and you have a Companion with you and you have members of three other clans in tow, it increases your odds.

I think this would also encourage people to cycle off their power alts and populate LS and, in the era of prerolled stats and xp scalps, that's not the most unreasonable ask to take advantage of a fun opportunity. At least that's how some of us with 10+ masters have entertained ourselves for years and years when a side/alt feels a little played out.

These are great ideas! It encourages diversity in the who list and group composition so that players will also be exposed to some of the less-played clans out there that add so much depth and diversity to the WoT world. Most the hardest and rewarding targets are done by Tower groups, which I don't really blame them because that's where the bonuses are. I miss the days when you'd see badass Red Eagle groups hitting the big stuff, higher numbers of Wingers/Companions raiding Tear, etc. Maybe off topic and not possible yet with current (but growing numbers), but I'd love to see clan activity for things like an Andor/Cairhien feud, revival of Mayene/Tear/Illian activity in the south, an active Sword & Hand for a feud with Tanchico...

With an older playerbase that many have accomplished a lot, it's natural to gravitate to the harder goals and bonuses, but with how those are implemented it means we lose some diversity that really adds a lot of fun and RP opportunity.

[Reyne]

That said, there are also oodletons of cityheads slain, which also yield qps. 1888 instances of that in the past 3 months, although a bunch of those are also DS as they are written to the same file. Essentially, cityhead smobbing has replaced heralds.

... Yeah I mean the group of DS that we know is organized and crushes all these things is probably the only one doing it though. More power to them but it's not exactly indicative of wide use. I've tried to get people to hit cities with me, it's not exactly something people are fired up to do (on LS anyway).

I understand if the thought was that it was too easy for too little effort but it's gone the other way now I think. The responses it this thread re the heralds seem to agree with that notion.

Am a little confused about the idea that everything is being sacrificed for PK. It seems there has been a lot of steps to make it easier for non PKers to gain qps, rares, tps etc. Which changes in the past couple years seem to have skewed the balance? To me it seems to have been trying to spread "the wealth" out among different kinds of players.

I don't necessarily agree bc I do think there has been quite a lot of added PvE and whatnot, but I think this feeling is coming from stuff like additional ways to be scouted and the snobbing itself being made more vulnerable to PK, such as the herald chains now ending more or less in the Blight. Like it's not just 'oh I'm PvEing and now by chance there's people here,' it is 'my PvE is being directed right to their doorstep so there's almost always PK involved.'

[zankou]

to be fair, 90% of ds cityheads, is flipping Baerlon...after scouting andor/4k/wb etc looking for pk. if only newbies on rats, we tend to get bored and check out/hit bearlon. If big enogh group we'll swing by jehannah and flip it too. I know when warriors were impossible to kill, we used to ways to tanchico and farm that.You want ds to stop hitting cityheads? Come out and pk.

[Reyne]

My point wasn't that I am mad about DS hitting city heads. Like I said: more power to them.

I was simply saying we all know it's just a couple power groups doing 95% of those hits and it's not some accessible PvE that a group of 3-5 who aren't bonused up masters or remorts can go do on a whim. It didn't exactly replace heralds, most of us just stopped doing heralds with no replacement. Hitting city heads also leads directly to PK so if you don't want PK then you're probably not going to go hit RK.

The entire point actually is people would like to do something other than PK without it being a foregone conclusion that they get involved with PK by the end and without a bunch of people telling them to learn to PK and get good if they don't like it.

[zankou]

My point wasn't that I am mad about DS hitting city heads. Like I said: more power to them.

I was simply saying we all know it's just a couple power groups doing 95% of those hits and it's not some accessible PvE that a group of 3-5 who aren't bonuses masters can go do on a whim. Hitting city heads also leads directly to PK...

The entire point actually is people would like to do something other than PK without it being a foregone conclusion that they get involved with PK by the end and without a bunch of people telling them to learn to PK and get good if they don't like it.

The thing is, it really isnt a power group hitting them. I hit bearlon with razhak all the time! 2-3 and a mob can flip it anytime. A warder pair probably can solo. And the entire point of this thread is how pk is killing pve, yet a group of people are attempting to shame another group of people for doing pve. its kinda silly to be fair.

[Reyne]

I'm obviously not talking about Baerlon. That's a CTF more than a city hit. It takes 15 minutes or less and you can only do it once a day.

yet a group of people are attempting to shame another group of people for doing pve. its kinda silly to be fair.

Well, I'm not. Do I need to say "good job" for the city hits that DS is making happen for a third time or can we address the points being made?