No need to recycle

[Maghus]

In all seriousness I actually strongly believe in preserving nature. The reason why the ancients used only stone to build is because they wouldn't kill trees for wood. Not only is veganism the correct path, but you shouldn't kill any plants either. The only things you should eat are things that can be plucked and not kill the plant. Like fruit and nuts. They are natures vending machines. Then when you excrete the waste later, the seeds come out and are already sitting in a pile of fertilizer. It was all created to be this way. The 'religion' I belong to aims to kill off 90% of the human population and live in harmony with Gaia. I believe that oil is the life-force/blood of the planet and burning it is the worst thing possible. I don't think that oil is dead dinosaurs, that's just bonkers. Mother earth uses its electro magnetic field to manage itself and sustain all life on it. I learned about a plot by evil people to hit the earth with a meteor, and then when the planet is using its electrical energy to heal itself, they steal the energy!

[Guester]

...Mother earth uses its electro magnetic field to manage itself and sustain all life on it. I learned about a plot by evil people to hit the earth with a meteor, and then when the planet is using its electrical energy to heal itself, they steal the energy!

That is the plot of Final Fantasy 7...

[Reyne]

@SteffenMalskaer got the difficult task of retrieving our oceanographic moorings and weather station on sea ice in North West Greenland this year. Rapid melt and sea ice with low permeability and few cracks leaves the melt water on top.

[Brione Furcas]

@SteffenMalskaer got the difficult task of retrieving our oceanographic moorings and weather station on sea ice in North West Greenland this year. Rapid melt and sea ice with low permeability and few cracks leaves the melt water on top.

Look at how happy those dogs are, least they arent going to freeze to death!

[Mronz]

Man, I love when Maghus posts!

Another disagreeing view. I'm sure I'm not the only person, that honestly just doesn't care, regarding climate change. I have no problem recycling, if it is convenient, and or free. EX: If i'm standing by a recycling can and a trash can, of course I'd throw the item in the correct can.

Expecting people to decrease their consumption of meat, to extend the life of the planet X amount of years... pretty sure that's never going to take hold.

[Reyne]

Yeah young people are well aware that older generations just don't care because they'll be dead before it matters. Meanwhile, tons of articles wondering why millennials aren't having kids as much.

https://www.theguardian.com/environment ... -countries

youth climate strikes held in 100 countries

[Landon]

I'm sure I'm not the only person, that honestly just doesn't care

You're not, which is why this is even an issue in the first place. It's sacrificing empathy for future generations in exchange for convenience/cost now.

[isabel]

The whole point of that article though is that this kind of individual focused empathy call is not a good way to look at something as large scale as climate change. Mronz is right actually - a lot of people can't or don't care, and he's being honest. It's too much. The point is that most people don't NEED to care - they just have to follow a good system which is the job of government. People don't really think about traffic rules - they just follow them because it's a good system. If each time you had to cross the road you have to channel deep empathy for global-level tragedy it would just be either unsustainable or some kind of indulgent masochism (which really, is what a lot of this forced veganism etc looks like).

People are pretty task oriented and quickly adapt/follow whatever the normal way of functioning is. Like most Indians don't have any clue about recycling, segregation etc. But very few Indians (or as many Indians as Swiss or any other nationality) are going to go to Switzerland or Sweden or wherever and mix up the garbage - they will just follow the rule as soon as they understand it.

So this whole thing of each person has to care deeply about climate change in every single action they take is just not sustainable. We HAVE to think in terms of systems, and what action will actually get the system to change - not your individual habits and lifestyle or what you put in your kitchen. For instance, someone in my city - a lawyer friend - lobbied hard to get a waste segregation rule in place. It really doesn't matter if she's vegan or not. What she got done has a phenomenally larger impact, and it didn't take her having to micromanage and reorient every second of her life at all. Instead of having 500 frustrating arguments with climate change deniers or whoever else, but essentially people who have no real power to impact the system, she worked with the people who can set the rule. Now everyone in her street, neighbourhood, area, had to largely follow a new method. And people were FINE following it - they didn't sit and think 'is this right or wrong'. They're thinking 'so okay I need to do this so that the city people collect my garbage'.

[Landon]

That's reading my comment a little to focused. It's not just referring to only recycling my water bottle if it's convenient and expecting to save the world. Do you think Mronz will support legislation that makes recycling free? Well, how about that "Nothing's free" conservative mantra? Are you going to convince Americans to convince their representatives that we should increase taxes to build and implement recycling facilities around the country? We will tax imports which force Americans to pay more for goods, but will we add a carbon/recycling tax to businesses or add regulations for material usage?

If you're not invested personally, how are you going to convince someone to support large scale change that will effect them? Arguing that one bottle at a time won't save the world doesn't mean there won't be personal sacrifices made to implement large scale change.

We need to broaden our definition of personal action beyond what we buy or use. Start by changing your lightbulb, but don’t stop there. Taking part in a climate strike or showing up to a rally is a personal action. Organizing neighbors to sue a power plant that’s poisoning the community is a personal action.

Voting is a personal action. When choosing your candidate, investigate their environmental policies. If they aren’t strong enough, demand better. Once that person is in office, hold them accountable. And if that doesn’t work, run for office yourself — that’s another personal action.

Take your personal action and magnify it into something bigger than what kind of bag totes your groceries.

So yes, I would say "not caring" is a pretty big problem.

[Reyne]

It's true that there is the individual vs the systemic issues but at some point you can't have systemic change without individuals caring enough to enact them. We don't just get good gov't policy by happenstance. Your lawyer friend still had to care enough to go out and do that. The farther up the national level you go the harder it is to do anything solo like that - you need a community behind you. There's a reason why the Koch Bros spend millions to convince people that nothing is happening. We get people looking at proposals like the New Green Deal and without even coming to the table to negotiate around what they don't like they just scoff and go "yeah right, eat less meat? Higher taxes to pay for proper recycling programs??? pfffffffffffffffffff" and continue voting for disaster.

Anyway yeah it's true that it isn't very productive to argue with deniers online but this was more of just a venting exercise for me.