Can we as players generally make clanning easier?

[Kerryk]

Personally don't see much difference in having the usual apprentice/applicant system compared to your clanning straight away then having a vote at rank 2-3.

Pros

Increased RP presence on the who list and in game with more WoT based atmosphere.
Gives clan rent to applicant.
Gives protection in home city for applicant.
Gives clan themed quests for applicant to do at own pace without waiting on other players time.
Standardizes procedures so that players are treated fairly in the beginning.
Assures all applicants fulfill all requirements and are not pushed along by their friends.
Creates meaning for early ranks.

Cons

[Kerryk]

Also like to say: Thank you all for the discussion so far!

[Samara]

Personally don't see much difference in having the usual apprentice/applicant system compared to your clanning straight away then having a vote at rank 2-3.

Pros

Increased RP presence on the who list and in game with more WoT based atmosphere.
Gives clan rent to applicant.
Gives protection in home city for applicant.
Gives clan themed quests for applicant to do at own pace without waiting on other players time.
Standardizes procedures so that players are treated fairly in the beginning.
Assures all applicants fulfill all requirements and are not pushed along by their friends.
Creates meaning for early ranks.

Cons

Applicants already show their affiliation by having Illian Companion aspirant in title, but could be that having the actual clan flag from the get go encourages newer players who see the who list full of Defenders, Lancers, Wardens etc. to try out the different clans.
Good points with regards to clan rent/mob assistance etc. imagine it would also feel more immersive? for newer players.
I think most clans already have their Applicant tasks clan themed. Most clans have zone quests etc. with focus on the zones surrounding their nations. Or smobs in their homelands etc.

I'm not saying its a bad idea, just don't see it to be a whole lot different than how it currently works or that it would remove much red tape, while creating a little extra workload for immortals with creating x amount of automated tasks for the clanmobs. I can only speak for the clans I'm in and the clans I've been part of, but most of them have a set of tasks to be completed before you can be voted upon. Can't recall last time I saw someone push their mates through the applicant part without completing the quests in any the clans I've been in, but I guess it does happen.

[Aurelius]

Cons

1. The possibility of having to deal with someone dragging your clan through the mud.
2. Having to declan someone. Honestly, the way you toss it out all nonchalantly like it's no big deal is astounding. Pretty much the messiest thing ever.

Pros

Increased RP presence on the who list and in game with more WoT based atmosphere. -This is a WoT based game. Providing you're trying to clan, you would be RPing this WoT atmosphere anyway.
Gives clan rent to applicant.-Okay? Not like there isn't hordes of rents around. I don't have a single character where all my rents are full.
Gives protection in home city for applicant. -I'll give you this one, even though it's not something I personally think even matters.
Gives clan themed quests for applicant to do at own pace without waiting on other players time. -Lots of clans have this already in their application process.
Standardizes procedures so that players are treated fairly in the beginning. -Non-standard procedures don't necessarily make things unfair. In my clanning experience they make things interesting more than anything else. They should however be standardized by the players in said clan.
Assures all applicants fulfill all requirements and are not pushed along by their friends. -What requirements? You're suggesting autoclanning.
Creates meaning for early ranks. -Any clan has the choice to create whatever meaning for whatever rank they want. Not that it even matters, you can make rank 4 in a couple of days.

I agree that there are some clans that are difficult to clan in because of inactivity. I think this could be, and has been successfully, alleviated by clans creating specific guidelines for clanning and actual standardization amongst their applicants. Giving applicants real timeline expectations is also a good thing, so that they're not left wondering how long they'll be expected to wait.

[Skadi]

My read of this - without knowing about any particular instances or people involved - is that creating a new system where r1-2 are the new 'applicant' stage wouldn't solve most of the problems you're talking about. Probably even worse if some clans implemented this and some clans didn't, just because of the extra confusion about what ranks mean.

Initially your problems with the current system were something along the lines of these, correct me if I left any out or misunderstood something:

1) Discrimination/preferential treatment for some applicants over others
2) Long and uncertain clanning time

Both of these problems can be solved pretty easily under the current system:

1) Clanning tasks that don't require (but can include) interaction with current members. Doesn't mean you get in just by doing the tasks, but I've always hated 'speak with 5 members and get their recommendation' because of how activity-intensive it can be and because it requires some level of activity on the part of the clan for it to even be possible to join, which won't always be the case.
2) The same tasks for every applicant. Pretty straightforward really.
3) Either general or strict guidelines on how long applicants have to complete tasks and how long the clan has to evaluate the applicant until a vote is called. Everyone's happier when there's some clarity on where in the process you are.

I think that being able to no-vote something is a very good thing. It gives you some measure of control over your clan and means that you can enforce some standards of behavior. On some level, if the people in the clan don't want you to join, why should you get to go against the wishes of the clan and join anyway?

[kirafa]

Getting to know players and making sure they are a good fit for the clan is important. There are players in my clans that I have never seen online, but I feel that I know them and like them because of their presence in clan forums. For low activity clans or clans with players who aren't in my timezone, just having forum access would be a great way to get that personal contact without having to be online at the same time.

[Itesh]

Speaking personally I'm not at all a fan of 'rank 1 and 2 are probationary'-style arrangements. Either clan people, or don't - as someone mentioned earlier, declanning people is rarely an uncomplicated thing and often gets messy.

People are more likely to vote no to clanning than they are to vote yes to declanning; no one likes to be perceived as being punitive (which is odd, considering we spend our time trying to kill people and take their things) and like Elysia says - people have a right to maintain the RP and good reputation of their clans.

Edit: In response to the original question, I'm not sure that clanning anywhere un-secret is actually all that difficult.

[Yasmin]

Guess my post regarding the cons of this got deleted

[Cerys]

Guess my post regarding the cons of this got deleted

If you had posted cons only, I would have left it.

[Elysia]

I agree that there are some clans that are difficult to clan in because of inactivity. I think this could be, and has been successfully, alleviated by clans creating specific guidelines for clanning and actual standardization amongst their applicants. Giving applicants real timeline expectations is also a good thing, so that they're not left wondering how long they'll be expected to wait.

I know of one clan that has a variety on this, in the sense of the clanimm getting full say on who is suitable for that clan or not, if the clan is completely inactive. Granted said imm is me and I have had that clan for over a decade, so I know what they are looking for in an applicant. One of the benefits of being the mud's Old Faithful, I guess.