Feedback request: the April weapons changes.

[Zeeb]

Thoughts from across various alts (most masters)

1. Dodge won't work consistently against jagged sword unless you are fighting non-masters (I thought dodge should just hands down beat combo in a 1v1 but maybe that has changed).

2. Seems that combo master with jagged was bashing just as good(or better) than my abs master (I'd think ABS weapons should bash more consistently especially vs combo and other abs).

3. Leather leaf - felt like I had more defense and better bash but with lower OB then jagged, seemed like a viable option.

4. Medium blades - seemed pretty weak

Suggestions: Find baseline for Jagged sword at top of 2 handed long blade class, base other top of class weapons around this.
1. Best club: same ob, +8 parry for shield pracs, + weight for bash
2. Best medium blade: same OB, +12-16 parry, same bash
3. Best 2 handed staff: - 5 OB, + 15 parry, +weight
4. Best non rare axe: +ob, -parry, +weight
5. Best fencing blade: +++OB, +parry, no bash

(assuming damage is kind of consistent with axes and poleaxes being significantly more).

[eviscerator]

Email me all the weapon stats and I'll fix it for you Elysia.

[Benito]

For whatever it's worth, I think 1h clubs are actually fairly solid, but only on masters. With the innate club bash bonus (this still exists as far as I know), they bash really reliably, and offer good defense. The damage and OB are just too low to use on non-masters. This is only really using steel-flanged, so I can't really offer insights on the class as a whole. The worst part of using them is Langois and Davor making fun of you if you don't remove it fast enough when they log on

The practice crunch is really something that's only applicable to DS and channelers. Even getting shield parry, it's not like I still can't get whatever pracs I want on a LS hunter.

[Elysia]

This is only really using steel-flanged, so I can't really offer insights on the class as a whole.

Knowing which item within a class that works helps, thanks.

[Rig]

After using flails for a full reset, the only problem was that they are unmendable. Which is terrible pking with scratched flail that already has dung dmg i.e. a jewel handled quirt. Not sure any of these flails would be useful for anything other than an fc to use for defense at the moment as it's literally just defense and terrible damage.

Leatherleaf is awesome. I feel like the ob is kinda meh but good enough bash and defense.

I like barbed steel, but I prefer blue steel still for the bash.

The only viable medium blade is a heron. Everything else is terrible. Maybe create one based around ocl?

Oddly curved longswords are great. Love them. Pale steel is still a channie weapon.

Jagged is still the best 2h lblade I'll agree with that.

Spears are okay. I hate spears.

Sblades are of course amazing.

Fblades are still eh, ruby rapier master is rough to fight.

A few things like mblades and a few better options other than 2h lblades would be cool. Maybe a flail that can be used with decent dmg other than the dark barbed flail for combo? Dunno. I really enjoyed ocl and flails.

[Eol]

Just a few thoughts based on Hress' damage testing:

Steel flanged mace is very similar looking to shining silver plated sword - 0.5lb heavier, slightly worse parry and OB. In theory its got the club bash bonus and it can go 2 handed for an extra damage.

I like barbed trident. I stared at barbed verse blue steel trident verse jagged last night. The numbers feel similar between the 3, but the blue steel damage just isn't enough for me.

Honestly the damage looks pretty good on spears when you compare them to most weapons.

I don't even know what to say about short blades. Attack + postures is sick.

Ruby rapier appears to have the same damage as CC, emerald foil, and pine javelin.

I think the crazy thing is always going to be - economy. We don't really have one. If you want to make a weapon in a class better than everything else you have to increase its rarity to some extent.

[Iskveri]

Over the years, the largest part of weapon issues has always stemmed from one issue. In the beginning, there were only somewhere between roughly 5-8(ish) weapons in any group and they had a clear hierarchy of bad to good. As time went on, too many implementors decided to add their little snowflake projects to the game and we ended up with damn near 20 weapons in categories, often with 3-5 "top tier" weapons in the group with minor specialties. That makes weapon balance utterly impossible. This game needs to prune that down and give each weapon class a clear focus. The two-handed parry garbage needs to utterly go if it isn't a staff. As a game designer, common sense should have told you before you implemented it that if you create something that gives offense and defense with 1 prac cost, why the blue hades would anyone spend twice that cost for a 1h weapon/shield to end up with inferior numbers?

This game was so much better when you only had 6 weapons in your weapon class and 4 of them were garbage you wielded to regear.

[Enok]

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[Lykan]

Enok for president.

[Sarryn]

As someone who routinely does practice a 1h option. I think there should be a bit more incentive for doing so. There is a lot of prac sink involved in this. Let's not forget some players choose str over dex for stats. Thus for example a 19 17 19 char is kinda in the dark. You have to keep in mind even now that super stats are rampant. There should always be weapons dedicated to the less statted of us. And I'm not saying that 19 17 19 isn't super...it's just you know you have to maximize those. Thus your generally going to use 2h weapons. Aka a 2h def long/spear/staff. But at the same time your still getting less defense because you have that low 17 dex. If you choose a 1h weapon with shield parry, well your about what 20 defense short compared to everyone else? That's a lot.

As a person who likes defensive weapons, over offensive I think the balance should be there. And the pracing of shield parry shouldn't be a boon to go 1h weapons. Unless I got a rare or unique I like 2h weapons. I generally pk alone or at least start pk alone often. I like my defense to do so. Specially with 90% being masters and masters with attack at that. (little exaggerated but yeah) Overall anything with current master op bs is gonna wreck compared to not masters.

Before we can fix weapons truly. We need to focus on masters and downing them. Especially for bonused players imo. These people are generally the elite. I have never understood why they need to be more elite via bonuses. I'm one of those that loves masters over non...I mean who wouldn't. It's almost terrible to go back to playing non masters vs masters. Like I want to master my other chars...but dam it's a joke kind of. Going against zerking master wars or fades etc. Your gonna get wrecked generally. Remove postures or down them. Make the ability to choose 1 of 3 setup styles per reset. Damage, OB, Defense. You shouldn't have your cake and be able to eat it to. Personally I hate bonus's. I mean I love them...but that's just a greedy easy kill side of me.

Back to weapons and what I've tried and opinions on some of the changes. This is all from a MASTERS point of view, so very skewed and biased as masters are sick with nearly anything.
1h clubs, agree with the majority of what people have been saying. The ob needs upped, the bash should be around heron bash. (not as good as 2h abs weapons mind you) There defense could use a tic up as well on a few of them. I haven't really tried them again. But I did before the changes and steel flanged mace was very viable.

1h axes, once again agree with what has been posted earlier. After you lose wicked axe, there is a nice drop off. Bring saw toothed axe up a tic. Maybe add .5-1.5 lbs on it. Make the ob more viable, damage should be good as well. I've used these after losing wickeds. While not terrible there not great. And again this is a master talking, so non master they'd be quite worse.

2h staffs I love leatherleafs, I loved them before the change. I used to go leatherleafs/axes or clubs fairly often. I think leatherleafs could use a bit more ob and damage though still. 1h staffs are a joke still, I'm not sure what can be done with that. Channie weapons, so I'll let those cherry pickers who play that class speak for that.

2h and 1h spears, 2h spears are ok I think they could use a bit more defense. Flee charging is a very annoying tactic, but very affective. As is charge in general. I don't much like charge for the simple fact it ruins resting at no hides lol. 1h spears barring partisans of ghealdan (which could use a slight up in ob) absolutely are terrible. I mean they are disgustingly terrible. Help them out somehow.

1h longs, I think the subtraction of defense last round wasn't wise. Literally as stated before not much reason to go this class. Other then you have a heron long... I personally do like the pales on a master. Because it's a ok bash, and defense option. But as a non master this class is completely useless imo. 2h longs, not much needed done to these now honestly. I think there just about right. Maybe bring back a little defense on I and G. It's nice to have options like this as a channeler or anyone for that matter.

Medium blades, if you don't have a unique or heron well good luck. They are terrible, I hate to even use a heron med if I don't have replacements. That's how bad they are. There a channeler's weapon. I would like to see them come back in line a bit. For variety sake. Scimitar should be the OB/damage weapon, with decent bash aka 10-12 lbs. Silver plated should be the kind of jagged equiv of the med blades. Thus meaning it should be 13-14 lbs, good damage/ob/bash/defense. And you should always get more defense with a 1h weapon then a 2h weapon.

Fencing blades, they serve there purpose really. I honestly hate these things. For the simple fact that they can disarm. There is really few things worse then losing a rare or something nice to disarm. Like it sucks...bad. I don't even want to fight these people if I'm rocking a heron or something of the nature 1h. There weight could all be upped a bit imo though. But other then that...yeah there ok.

Short blades, I know people keep saying down damage and all that....are you like not thinking when you say this? Because yeahhhh that's gonna promote fleebie ass loser rogues to just do it even more. I personally haven't played stab a lot in a long long time. I don't like it, it's not my cup of tea. But when I do prac stab, honestly I play it like I don't even have it. I love the sblades, which is why I prac them as a 2nd weapon usually. I don't think there should be anything negative done to this class. This is a class onto it's own. This is the only real viable option for rogues. (Granted Rig has been a boss in trying other things and I really love that) I used to do the same back on my rogue it was feasible for sure. Specially as a master. But anyways yeah. Don't fk with these please. I want to see rogues meleeing more and stabbing less. I hateeeeeeeeeeeeeeee and everyone else I know hatessssssssssssssss fking fleebie rogues. I don't want to give them more reason to do this. That being said, CC is the king of this class. Jades/kris/red stones kind of suck imo. Unless your talking about stab and or melee ob/damage. Maybe look into the these?

Javelins, still crap honestly. Not a viable option.

Flails, field mend...nuff said.

Polearms haven't tried so no comment.

Abs weapons, really there all pretty decent. Bronze axe is sick with the damage, wicked the same. Clubs could use some OB love, on maul and even mallet. No weapon should be amazing at everything though really. I like the variety of these options.

2 cents